If you’re serious about building a Protected & Profitable™ business in 2022, you won’t want to miss out on this interview with Tara Newman, Profit First™ Certified Small Business Coach & host of The Bold Money Revolution Podcast.

We chat all about:

⚡️ How you can benefit from using Profit First™ in your business

⚡️ Why profitability should be top of mind as you grow

⚡️ What a sustainable business really looks like

⚡️ Why revenue goals must go beyond the $100k mark

⚡️ How to begin paying yourself as the owner of your business

🎧 Listen to this interview on Apple Podcasts: Coaches & Company Radio

DM us @coachesandcompany or leave a comment below with your thoughts, how you enjoyed the interview, & any follow up questions you have! We wanna hear from you!

You can learn more about Tara below:

@thetaranewman on Instagram


Watch the full interview below 👇🏽

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Read the transcript below:
Disclaimer: This transcript has been auto-generated – please excuse any typos or grammatical errors. 


Hello, everyone and welcome. My name is Yasmine Salem Hamden and today I am here with Ali Williams. Aly is a financial literacy coach and educator and the founder of financially focused. Hi, Alli.


Thanks for having me. Yes, me. I’m so excited to be here today talking about money and Profit First with your crew.


I am so here for it. I love it. And thank you again. So let’s, for those not familiar with you yet, if you would please share a little bit about you and your work.


Yeah. Yeah, I’m Tara Newman. I’m the CEO and founder of the bold leadership revolution. And I am a business growth and profit first certified consultant and I work with women, small business owners, service based women who are selling a premium service or program. And they are looking to really create that financial and personal freedom that I think all of us really look for when we strike out and start our own businesses.


Yes, that is, I mean, it’s music to my ears, for sure. Because that is part of our ultimate mission is supporting women in achieving that financial independence through entrepreneurship, and of course, creating a protected and profitable business by having the necessary legal protections in place, which you know, is our jam. So I’m super excited for our conversation today. And to talk about using the profit Profit First method. This is a method I have utilized in my own businesses. And so let’s kick things off if you could share with us what Profit First is, please. Sure, Profit


First is a method that was designed by Mike McCalla wits, the author of the book Profit First, as a matter of fact, right here. So know if you’ve seen this book, this is what we’re talking about. If you haven’t seen this book, you might want to check it out. And really, Mike’s mission is to end entrepreneurial poverty, because 83% of small business owners are living paycheck to paycheck. And so what he’s wanting to do is to take people from having these cash eating monsters of a business that you’re constantly having to feed the beast, more money to being a money making machine. And then we’re I kind of pick up with my work, yes, I want to absolutely help women service providers, also take it a step further and say, Okay, once you’ve gone from this cash eating machine to a money making machine, how do we take the money making machine and turn it into a wealth creation machine and get it making even more money for you, without you having to work so darn hard for it? Right. So really looking at how we can use our businesses, as you know, a cash generating asset that then funds other cash generating assets, whether it’s real estate, whether it’s an index fund, whether it’s stocks, and or investing in another business, where now we’re starting to get that money working for you, where you don’t have to be working so hard for it.


Alright, so Profit First is a really simple it’s actually a very simple system. And it’s simple but not easy, right? Because we all have our stuff around money, we all are coming at money with different perspectives, beliefs, you know, generational stories we have money has like every intersection, you know?


Oh, no, hang on, we’re getting a little choppy, I think we have some technical issues going on. Alright, we’re back with Tara, just a little bit of technical issues, no big deal. We’re rockin, let’s go. Or just got


a lot of patients. You know, so it’s a simple system, but it’s not easy to implement. And so it’s basically ever had like a grandparent or a parent that manage their money using different envelopes, whereas like, their income came in, and then they split it out for like groceries on entertainment. And like, my buddy did this, right? Like, my dad did this, that’s basically Profit First, but what we’re doing is we’re doing it for business. And we’re taking it and creating different bank accounts, it flows your money in where you have your income coming in. And then you start to split it out by profit, by CEO pay by taxes, and by expenses. And the beauty of that system is it’s really behavioral. And it meant to prime your brain to take your profit off the top first, then pay yourself, then pay your taxes and with what you have left over. So it’s forcing constraint, like Parkinson’s Law. That’s what you use for business expenses, because so many of us have been taught that you pay your expenses first, that you you pay your debts, you know. And so what happens is, as business owners, we take on more and more expenses, and never write our tie, pay ourselves first. So that’s really behavioral premise behind Profit First is really getting business owners to fund the lifestyle and fund the extras. And so I get a lot of questions from people like why profit? Why do I need profit? Why, like they understand that they need to pay themselves, but it’s like, why the Prophet peace. And so the difference between profit and paying yourself as per the Profit First methodology is that profit is.


So I get asked a lot of times, like why profit and profit is the reward for the business owner, for putting in all the effort. It’s, you know, half of it is meant to stay in the business as a cash, you know, fund, I call it the self fund, fund. You know, so many of us are funding our own dream, we’re funding our own businesses, we don’t have angel investors, or venture capitalists, or maybe even loans. And if the last year kind of said anything, it’s always good to have some cash on hand, in case you need it, in case you didn’t get the eidl, or PPP, you kind of have your own there. And then the other half of it is to go on vacation, make additional investments, enjoy home improvement projects, right. And that is on top of what you pay yourself. paying yourself through the business is what funds your, your everyday lifestyle. And that’s kind of how they, how they think about the difference between profit and CEO pay and why you would need profit. And obviously, you know, you, you want to be able to not just afford your basic needs, but you’re going to really have a lifestyle that complements your values and your desires.


Yes, absolutely. And be able to support other causes and organizations that you either you personally or your values are in alignment with theirs or your business, your company stands in alignment with those of that organization are that cause and that you want to support. So that’s where that comes from.


Yeah, so profitability. I’ve been really thinking about this lately, especially in terms of like, even capitalism and how important profitability is and running a profitable business is to conscious capitalism. And you know, when an economy becomes recessive, which it’s not currently we actually are in a very good economy, economy, but when even when like, crummy kind of gets wobbly People look to small business owners to really bring bring our our, you know, economy back, right? We, yeah, we can only do that if we’re profitable. Yes, you know, we can only hire people in our businesses create jobs, hire contractors, or have the income coming in to support other small businesses. And I always say like think broader than the online space, think about, you know, maybe your local massage therapist, your hairstylist, your kids go to a tutoring center, run by a woman, um, you know, your local business economy as well. But if we don’t, if we’re not paying ourselves and have profit in our business, we can’t use that money to stimulate the economy. And like, who are we giving our dollars to? And how is that making the greatest impact? I think, you know, that needs to be considered, as well. And when we have really profitable businesses, we have a lot of leeway and flexibility in our pricing, the programs that we offer, if we need to shift and change gears, you know, knowing that we have that income coming in, and that we’re using it as best as we can, does provide a lot of peace of mind and a lot of opportunity for us to create the thing that we want to create. And what I see happening a lot is, you know, people come into small business ownership for two reasons, we talked about them financial freedom, personal freedom. But what I’m watching happen is people really sacrifice their personal freedom, for the financial freedom, or what they think will bring them financial freedom. And at that point, technically speaking, if we’re being very honest, you can reach financial freedom and independence working a job, you can, you know, your company is going to pay you a great salary, especially today, when, when it’s hard to find help, and people are leaving their jobs at a rapid rate. My professional colleagues who are still working in corporate are negotiating salary packages that are are tremendous. You know, they give you a 401k, a lot of companies give you a 401k match. So, you know, creating financial independence requires you to make money, spend your money intentionally, and invest the money that you save, you can do that working a nine to five job, it’s that personal freedom, that should actually be valued higher than the financial freedom, but we’re the first ones to sacrifice that personal freedom for the potential of financial freedom. Hmm,


that’s an excellent point you make. And so that’s kind of like the the concept of, you’re either creating a very expensive and time consuming, very demanding hobby, or you’re creating a very time consuming and demanding job for yourself where everything rides on you. And I mean, that’s I can relate to that. So, so much, and that, in my law, practice, you know, my routes and options available to me at the beginning of my legal career was, I could go down the traditional law practice route and join a law firm and work the 6070 hours that they were talking about, which that is just unacceptable to me. But it’s a conversation for another day. Or, and of course, that comes with a great salary comes with great benefits, but I’m thinking okay, the money sounds cool. But when am I going to get to enjoy my life? What am I going to even get to enjoy that pay? When am I going to enjoy that financial freedom and financial independence if I am just working around the clock and have to be on have to be present, and lacking that personal freedom? And so that other route for me was entrepreneurship, which I think we can all relate to those moments of sacrificing and you know, that it requires sacrifice at times, and there are seasons? Yeah, there’s seasons where that certainly, but you know, for me, it was a matter of figuring out the designing the business that I wanted to be a part of and figuring out what my where am I going to be able to provide the most value within this company and putting in place and recruiting others to provide support in the areas that I did not need to be spending hours in right because those hours I think there’s a direct connection between The number of hours you’re having to spend in your business doing business activities and your personal freedom that you’re getting to enjoy.


Yeah, and the value of all of those pieces and tasks, you know, because the interesting thing is, is I know a lot of the people in your community or online business owners and online business ownership get sold, as you know, very low entry greatly, you don’t have to make a big investment. It’s a it’s a low barrier to entry. But it’s one of the most expensive business models I’ve seen, when you start to really get into falling into the different marketing tactics and fads and how quick social media can change. And it can get very expensive. And what people don’t realize is there’s cost and time on both sides, there’s cost to making the sale, and there’s cost and time in delivering the product. And not all revenue is created equal, some revenue is just quite frankly, more profitable revenue.


Yeah, yeah, certainly, I mean, depending on what is required of you, once the sale is made, you know, and I think there’s this, that’s where we start to get into trouble in this online space where, you know, once the sale is made, a service needs to be rendered, and people think that their time to shine is during the pre sale. But in actuality, once the sale is made, that’s when you gotta gotta show up, and you’ve got to deliver. And, you know, do what it is that you conveyed you would be capable of doing. And so all of that is, you know, being able to having a system that generates leads and puts you into contact with or supports you in getting into contact with people that you can help and support, closing those sales and then delivering service successfully and to the satisfaction of your clients. All of that is just necessary in terms of having a profitable, but like, that’s baseline right is having proving the concept. It’s something in demand, it’s something that you can successfully deliver, you’re able to support your clients and getting those results, you’re consistently having those sales, completing those sales, and then you’ve got the money in the bank. And so what now, so you’re saying we have these, we create these different accounts, for the profit for owners pay or co pay for expenses for taxes, which is something that a lot of people, they think once the money hits my bank account that’s online, like, we want to be proactive. You know, I’m always preaching about being proactive. And so we want to set aside those taxes. And is that where you I know that there’s so much that can be done after that, and obviously, as far as like, using that, to leveraging that rather, to create other wealth for yourself for your family. But for those that are like, Okay, I haven’t even paid myself yet. What recommendations do you have for those folks that are haven’t paid myself? I’ve just been reinvesting in the business. Yeah.


So, you know, I think that the beauty of Profit First is it gives you a line of sight, it gives you some peace of mind. But it also I find for women specifically does is it gives them a language for money. And it gives them a framework to communicate about money to themselves to their maybe their their partner, their their their life partner around money. And it gives them a framework for how they can start to pay themselves. And I think you know, what you said is very valid that in the beginning, you were reinvesting into the business, in your startup phase 100%. That is what that’s what businesses do. It takes money to invest. You can’t cobble together a business based on freebies and free Facebook groups, and things like that. So you need contracts, for example, right? Like you need contract.


And you need to account for that you need software and different tools, things. Yes, that can automate certain aspects of your business ways to enhance your client experience. Like you might want to decide to invest in that. And yes, I mean, there are a number of things for sure. Exactly. Right.


Yeah. And so when I first started my business, and I was not new to business, but when I first started my business, I was like, Oh, if I were to make $100,000 in my corporate job, That’s not the same as $100,000 in revenue in my business.


Oh, no, you know, actually owning a business is so eye opening, because it made me realize how $100,000 is not that much.


No, it’s not a lot of money, that’s really not


a lot of money.


So it’s not a lot of money according to Profit First and the if you know anything about Profit First, everybody knows the percentages. And please do not go and apply the percentages in the book straight to your business without any guidance. Because you know, you you could you could be applying around certain percentages, because the percentages in his book are meant for what he calls fiscally elite businesses, you may not be starting there, you may be starting someplace else. And what I love, love love about Mike’s philosophy and how he does Profit First is all about marginal gains. It’s all about slow, incremental. You don’t have to be there overnight. Rome wasn’t built in a day. Right? And that is so calming. Yeah, when you can really be like, Okay, I’m gonna run with this. Yeah, like, I don’t have to be perfect. Like, I’m going to get there. Right. And so in the book, there’s percentages. And if you were a fiscally elite business, and you’re making $100,000 a year, that means you are paying yourself $50,000 A year stuff. I mean, maybe if you’re single, yeah, maybe if you’re, if you’re like, I don’t have a minimalist, minimalist, minimalist. Maybe if you’re maybe if you’re not living in a high cost area. But like, that feels really tight to me. Yeah. Even if you have a partner who’s making a financial contribution, you know, your expertise and your services, if you are an, you’re a true expert, somebody who’s been doing this a long time, somebody who has honed their craft, someone who has gone to school, right, someone who continues with their professional development, your experience should be commanding a higher pay than that, in my opinion. I want to I want better, I want to see better for folks. Um, and so that’s a real tight spot. But I think also what Profit First does is I get when you get women and you’re like, Oh, I’m uncomfortable charging. I feel maybe a little greedy. You know, we tell ourselves some some interesting stories, right? When you actually look at if you’re charging $2,000 for something 1000 of that is yours. The other 1000 is going to paying your taxes is going to pay your expenses, right? You’re gonna keep half of that. And I always like make a joke. And I’m always like, you’re not running off to buy like a Birkin bag. Like, every time you sell something like there. There’s like other things that you need to pay for in your business. It’s


okay, like, it’s not a pure profit situation. Right?


Like, I really do. I think people start to feel like they’re somehow like some snake oil salesman when when they start to sell and it feels icky. And they’re nervous about it. But the reality is, is things cost money. Yeah,


it costs money to sell. It can cost me money to serve. Yes, it does. Does. That’s the reality. And I think I think some consumers also have the perception that it’s pure profit for business owners, but that’s just not the case. Regardless of what you’re selling. There are costs associated with doing business.


And when you have that profit, first breakdown, you can confidently communicate the value in what you’re charging because you know, where the money is going.


Yes. And it provides no objective. Oh, I’m sorry. I didn’t mean to I think there was a slight but I was gonna say it provides you with some objectivity in terms of how do I price what I’m providing by figuring out what my costs of doing business are and then using that as an anchor in figuring out what what your pricing that offer, depending on a number of factors we can, it might be a conversation for another day. But that’s definitely a relevant a relevant consideration here.


Yeah. And so the the other things around paying yourself right so it gives you a place to start. It gives you an understanding of like, how much money you know you would have to pay yourself. It gives you perspective in the sense that in Profit First, it says, okay, like, all the things that are in your business that benefit you, as a business owner are considered your pay. And I know some accountants get like, that’s not accurate. But this isn’t about accounting. This is about cash flow management. Yeah, right. And so for example, like, if you put your car through your business, if you put your cell phone through your business, you know, those things would go under your CEO pay. And what it does is it helps you communicate, I hear from women all the time, like my husband wants to know when I’m going to start bringing home money, or like, they want to know when my business is going to start paying off more. And the reality is, is that some of them are actually making money and bringing it home. But because we pay ourselves so differently than maybe our partner, in a nine to five job gets paid. It’s not realized, as as income to the family. And so, you know, inside my programs, I give people a breakdown, where they can see their total cash compensation that they are taking out of the business, so that they can go and say, This is how I’m paying myself, it’s I’m paying for my car, I’m paying for my cell phone, you know, I’m paying for, you know, maybe there’s some rent or something that’s out of the house, you know, and I’m taking home this amount of money. And so it becomes clear exactly how you’re benefiting from the business.


Yes. And it makes it clear with certainty that this is not just an expensive hobby.




Yeah, no, I definitely I definitely understand. So as far as rewards, are you a cashback or miles person?


Yes. Yeah, it’s i. So you said you have that in your program. So your main program is the bold profit Academy Academy? Yes. Tell us about that for you.


The bowl profit Academy is a program that helps women get to about $250,000 in revenue, if that’s what they want. And the reason why I use that number is to go back to the conversation, we were just having about $100,000. a year in revenue isn’t that much based on profit? First, you know, Profit First, the method, if you’re bringing in $250,000 in revenue, you can pay yourself if you choose six figures, because it’s 50%. So you would be able to pay yourself $125,000 If you choose and why I say if you choose is because Profit First is not meant to be rigid. In the sense of this is what you have to do. I like to think of it in terms of we’re going to use this tool to help you make intentional decisions and choice.


Yes. Right. And


so you know that programming there is around how do we help you get your business? Beyond that $100,000 mark, give you the information you need to make these choices and show you the most profitable growth strategies to use in terms of generating leads. Converting leads, what are the most profitable programs and services that you can offer without over delivering, because so many women are burning out from over delivering and under earning? Oh, yeah, for sure. You know, we do the math around what it looks like to increase your price because we make a whole big story out of this and I’m really big on can we do the math before we talk about mindset? Can I show you the numbers and see if seeing something in black and white changes the way you’re thinking about something it might not and then we can have that conversation but it might right and so what does that look like in terms of math and then once you’re making this money How do we use it because that’s what I hear from so many women is like I don’t know what to do with my money and it’s you know coming up with like the how to pay yourself making sure you’re putting money aside for your taxes or that we’ve you know, helped you pay back taxes that you might out and then how do you make the make the smartest decisions about growing your business what is really going to be worth that investment and how is that going to pay you back?


Hmm Okay, so one thing that you mentioned and I absolutely so appreciate this is that starting out with instead of starting out with mindset, which I’m not here to knock mindset, it’s a it’s foundational as well. But let’s get some clarity on like, what’s the reality here? What is the actual state of affairs and look at these numbers because You might be thinking as a business owner, like, oh my gosh, my business is a mess, we’re not profitable, my expenses are out of control. I don’t, I cannot, there’s no way I can pay myself right now. But when you sit down and really look at the actual numbers, maybe the reality is like you could have been paying yourself, or you are actually profitable, we’ve got these unnecessary expenses that you can flush, or maybe you have room for additional expenses and other ways that you could potentially invest at this stage of your business. So I just want to highlight that so good.


Yeah, you know, listen, I’m a huge fan of things like law of attraction and manifesting, it’s super fun. Um, and mindset, you know, my background is in Organizational Psychology and Organizational Development. I am I am a behaviorist. At my at my core, and and all those things are in the mix. But how many times have we work to feel good about our money, but it never actually equated to money in the bank account? Right? Yeah. And our, your feelings and your emotions are valid. We are human beings. But they’re also not fact.


Yes, you can say that again.


And absolutely. And I’m here to hold space for both of that I’m okay. That’s why I do the math first. And then I’m like, Okay, how do you feel about that now? Do we still need to have this conversation? But if we do,


right, yeah. I appreciate that. I think that’s such an important thing to address. Was there something else you wanted to add to that? No,


that’s good. No,


I so appreciate you, Tara. And I think that this method Profit First, the concept of profitability, having that at the forefront of our minds, and of our overall intentions for our business and plans for our business, definitely a game changer, certainly necessary. And I am sure that so many of our listeners are going to find this useful. Tara has a no, you have a tool that you want to share with us. And we’re going to link to it. What does that called?


Yes. So I have a tool called the revenue goal calculator. And what this does is, you know, we’re in a noisy time, right? There’s like a lot of input, and there’s a lot of like, seven, figure this and eight, figure that and listen, I’m here for it. Like, it’s great. Let’s normalize women having money. But sometimes it could become a distraction. And sometimes it can be it can cause overwork. So what I really want to do is help people understand, like, what is the purpose of their money, let’s give your dollars a job. And you use that to create your revenue goals. So what the revenue goal calculator does is it has you put in your expenses, your personal financial responsibilities, and then it tells you how much you need to pay yourself. So if you’re like, how much do I even need to pay myself in my business? This is going to help you do that. And it’s going to be based on fact, right? Not like pie in the sky, maybe big dreams, but not in reality. Again, I’m here for the big dreams, but I want to make them reality. Right? So this kind of starts to make them reality. And then what it does, is it reverse engineers, then what you need to bring in revenue in your business, how much of that revenue is going to go to taxes, how much of that revenue should go to expenses. So how much you get to invest and spend on your business, it’s going to tell you based on how much money you need to earn and the calculator is it’s an Excel comes with a 15 minute training, and you can then go okay, these are my basic expenses, but like, what if I really want that luxury lifestyle? Like what if I really want to swing for the fences? plug those numbers in? How does that shift what you need to bring in in your business? I’m gonna tell you, shockingly enough. And I get a lot of flack for this around like people being like, are you having a limited mindset? I don’t know. Maybe. But I actually think I’m just being realistic. When you do the numbers around Profit First $250,000 in revenue is a real sweet spot. So you know, if you’re somebody who wants to make great money and or wants to hit a certain benchmark starting out, but has kids and has a life and has things going on, you know, if you can get yourself to that $250,000 Mark, you’re paying yourself six figures, you’re taking profit from the business, you have money to hire help. And you can then decide whether or not you want more but let’s first have you get enough.


Yeah, for worse meets our needs. Let’s meet


those needs. And then we can decide about more than enough like, you know, like Maslow’s hierarchy of needs, right? Like let’s get to the meat It’s handled in order before we go to this place of self actualization, and like super pie in the sky dreams, because I really think that sometimes having such a huge goal that doesn’t feel tangible and grounded is actually stopping people from from having the money they need today.


I mean, and it’s easy to see how that is how people are coming into that experience and into the those thoughts because, you know, there’s this picture painted in so many different marketing messages as far as like jumping from A to Z, from a $0 in annual revenue to 1 million plus an annual rec revenue. And that’s just not realistic for most people. And, you know, I, I appreciate you say, like, you know, you might think it’s one response to your stance is like, Oh, you’re, you’re limiting yourself, that’s a limiting belief. And I always say, I’m like, am I being Am I being a pessimist? Or am I being realistic? You know, or am I being limited in my mindset? Or am I being realistic? And that differs for everyone, but realistically, to go from $0 in annual revenue to $1 million plus in annual revenue? Yeah, that’s, that can do more harm than good in terms of your entrepreneurial journey. Plus, if


you do the math based on Profit First, you don’t wind up taking home that much more, because your expenses go up.


Absolutely, absolutely. And these are.


Yeah, so it becomes it becomes like, here’s the thing at $250,000 I want you to make a choice. That’s it. Right? Like, it’s, it’s not about limited mindset or not, it’s about empowerment, and it’s about discernment. And it’s about saying, Okay, I got here and if I get to this next point, then I can have the thing that I’m you know, that financial independence requires me to make more in my business, but it might not.


Yeah, no, you’re right. I am here for the financial independence I’m here for the personal freedom even more and I think they do go hand in hand. I think it’s easy for us to get it can be easy for us to get distracted by all of these different things and all everybody has their their take on how to get to that point but there are fundamental requirements to building that sustainable business and a business that you know, you might there might be some people out here hitting that you know, seven figures but I want to also say the expenses that’s the behind the scenes that people don’t share. There are a lot of people out here talking about build a seven figure business build a six figure whatever it might be, I’ve done it myself and okay, maybe you have done it yourself. But how much did it cost you to get to that point, how much of that seven figures was actual profit, if any? Right that matters and if you are considering working with somebody to support you in your business and to help you grow your business and enhance your business these are the kinds of questions you should be asking them if their marketing is centered on build an X number of dollars business or achieve X number of dollars in revenue. I’ve done it myself Okay, so if you’ve done it yourself, what percentage of that is was actual profit? What percentage of that was your take home? What are you actually taking home what percentage of that was advertising or expenses period to get an actual I have a clear idea and accurate idea of the type of business they have experience in building and if that is in alignment with the type of path that you seek to take in your business and I am just so appreciative of you Tara for joining me for this conversation for sharing your knowledge and if you are interested in learning more about Tara and her work and connecting with her we’re gonna have all her information in the show notes in the description of of wherever you’re watching, listening or reading this interview. And again, thank you Tara, for being here and for being you.


Thanks for having me


I’ll talk to you soon.

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